#134 Avoiding Conflict: How to stop crying behind closed doors with Joanne Daniels — Martina Fink

Joanne Daniels is a 32 year old mum of one who has a high pressured job working as Finance Manager for a London based Asset Management company.

She often reached the point of burn out, putting the demands of her job / needs of others before herself, which was affecting her health and her relationships and she knew something needed to change. She has several perfectionist tendencies, which have served her well in some respects, and not so well in others.

Due to working remotely, especially in the past year, she was able to dedicate more time to herself and finally prioritised herself.

Jo recently graduated from Perfectionist Rehab and said: "This course has changed me as a person for the better, and I feel blessed to be able to share my story with others, to hopefully inspire others that they can do this, they can change and take steps towards the glow life, and it is reachable if you put your heart and mind to it."

IN TODAY’S EPISODE, WE TALK ABOUT:

Migraines, relationship conflict, and snappy behavior
Why your feelings as a perfectionist matter
How to make new friends where you can share with no fear of being judged
How to never again cry behind closed doors
Why knowing your core values can improve work + your life outside of work
How to be in tune with yourself

And so much more!

Have you downloaded the free Self-Care Guide for Perfectionist? Click here to access it:
martinafink.lpages.co/perfectionist-bundle

EPISODE RESOURCES

Learn more about Perfectionist Rehab

TODAY’S EPISODE TRANSCRIBED:

Martina Fink 0:00

This is episode number 134 with Joanne Daniels. Welcome to the glow life podcast. The one and only place for ambitious, high achieving and perfectionist women like you who want to leave overwhelm behind. Turn self doubt into self confidence and learn to trust yourself again, so that you can work less fully love and accept yourself and live a fulfilled and glowing life. Every week, I'll be giving you tips and inspiration on how to think less, feel more slow down, you can use your body and your daily habits to help you step up, level up and glow up in all areas of your life. This is not just about the big shifts, you can glow just a little more every single day.

Martina Fink 1:02

Welcome back to the glow life podcast. In today's episode, we are talking to my beautiful client Joanne and Joe has experienced a massive shift and transformation in her own life going from perfectionist and overworking herself and snappy mom to a place where she has just been able to truly be herself and release a lot of the stress that she was experiencing before. And before we dive into all of that stuff. I also wanted to let you know that the program which Joe has actually gone through called perfectionist rehab is open for enrollment until April 18. And we're starting with a new round of perfectionist women who are very high achieving and successful but tend to overwork themselves because there's so much to do and we always want to please everyone at work right. So if this is something that you are interested in, you can find more on Martina Fink comm forward slash rehab and the link is also in the show notes to learn more about the program. And before we get started with today's really beautiful share with Joe, I wanted to share my top glow Tip of the Week with you which is something every perfectionist needs to do it is to do one thing at a time, multitasking is something that keeps you so scattered and overwhelmed mentally, and you feel like you have a 57 tabs open in your mind every day. And I am sure that you have experienced this before. So my challenge for you today. And if you want to extend it to more than today, totally feel free to do that is to just do one thing at a time. And you will most probably catch yourself scrolling through Instagram as you are on a team call or messaging with friends as you are watching something on Netflix. Or maybe you're making your bed while you are brushing your teeth. This is something that still happens to me sometimes, and I need to catch myself too. So I believe that how we do one thing is how we do everything. If you make your bed while you brush your teeth, you most probably multitask in other areas of your life as well. So where can you become aware of your actions today and notice and catch yourself when you are switching in between a million different tasks at the same time and can you just switch it off and do one thing at a time. Once that is finished, you can move on to check your phone and scroll through Instagram, respond to comments and messages and just take one thing at a time today. And now let's get started with Joe Daniels. Joanne is a 32 year old mom of one who has a very high pressure job working as a finance manager for a London based acid manager she often reached the point of burnout, putting the demands of her job and the needs of others before herself, which has affected her health and her relationships and she knew that something needed to change. She has several perfectionist tendencies which have served her well in some respect and not so well in others due to working remotely and especially in the past year, she was able to dedicate more time to herself and finally learned how to prioritize herself. She recently graduated from perfectionist rehab, our signature program and she said this course has changed me as a person for the better and I feel blessed to be able to share my story with others to hopefully inspire others that they can do this. They can change and take steps towards the glow life and it is reachable. If you put your heart and mind to it summing that up your life will not become better if you don't do anything about it. In today's episode we talk about migraines for relationship conflict and snappy behavior with your children why your feelings as a perfectionist matter so much how to make new friends where you can just share with no fear of being judged how to never cry again behind closed doors, why knowing your core values can improve your work and your life outside of work, how to be in tune with yourself and be more of yourself, and so much more. And you can find everything we talked about today in the show notes at Martina Fink comm slash podcast slash 134. Welcome, Jo, I am so grateful and so excited to have you on the podcast today.

Joanne Daniels 5:40

Thank you very much for having me.

Martina Fink 5:42

It was such a pleasure to work with you in the past few months and help you kind of shift out of perfectionism and overwhelm and the high pressure and the expectations that you're used to have in the past. And I want to talk about all the things over the course of this episode. But the first thing I would really love to kind of dive in to with you is something that we just discussed before we started recording, which is your hair situation, which is like a perfect scenario for a perfectionist to release the control. So can you tell us what happened?

Joanne Daniels 6:16

Yeah, of course. So obviously, with lockdown and being at home, most of the time, I tend not to worry about makeup or making an effort. But as, as you mentioned to me that this might be seen by others, I thought I should make an effort. So yeah, I was curling my hair getting ready, allowed enough time to get everything done. And then my straightness just started to stop working. And I think something wrong with the cable. So typically, three quarters of my hair was all nicely cold. And then the rest of it, I left the top to last because that's what you do. So at the most bit, the most obvious bit of it was just Yeah, not doing what I wanted to do. But luckily, I managed to sort of hold it in position for it to get a bit hot. And then quickly, like, make do be a complete example of a perfectionist trying to like have perfect code. And it's just yeah, it's doing what it's doing. But at least it looks similar across the whole of my head.

Martina Fink 7:04

Would you have reacted to this differently if this happened six months ago?

Joanne Daniels 7:09

Yeah, definitely. I think I think even the whole idea of doing this podcast, I would have been worrying and fretting about what I would say and how it would come across, like what I would look like. But to be honest, I need like maybe 20 minutes ago, I was like, right, I should start getting ready. And try not to overthink things, because actually, it just makes it puts a lot more stress on myself. And it's just one of those things isn't that I can't do anything about my hair and what it wants to do. So just have to try to make do. But yeah, definitely changed from how I would have been before.

Martina Fink 7:40

Yeah, one of the things we talk about a lot in the perfectionist rehab program is control and releasing the things we cannot control. Like, what else could you have done, you know, when you when your curling iron breaks, it's out of your control, you could run to the store and buy a new one. But that's probably not possible in the time. So you just go with the flow and like kind of get over it as good as you can find a solution in that moment. So I would love for you to give us a little bit of a picture of what your life looks like six months ago, and kind of the struggles you were experiencing on a daily basis with your very high demanding job and, you know, being a mother at the same time as well.

Joanne Daniels 8:20

Yeah, I think I'm exactly as you mentioned, if it was very difficult for me, and I think I've got perfectionist tendencies, and I think some of them have worked well for me in the past and, and do still in some ways, because I think the reason I've got the job I've got is because I'm quite driven and quite motivated. And I think that comes from that sort of perfectionism. Like I want the next thing I want to do better, I want to do better. But I found that I got myself into a point where I was trying to apply this perfectionism status to everything. And it just wasn't, it's not sustainable. You'll never like regardless, you can read a million books, but you're never going to be the perfect mom, because you've got an independent child who is partly reflection of you, which is also very annoying, because she like does things and I'm like she's learned that from me. But you know, I mean across the board, like you're not in control of everything in your life. There's other external factors. And I think I just got to the point where I would push myself so hard that I'd end up burning out to the military. I'd like to have migraines I end up being off sick from work because I pushed myself to the point of exhaustion, but working evenings like especially being at home, having a lot more time with with Rosalie which is great, but like working remotely, but then I'd like literally log off straight into the other room playing with her doing bath time doing dinner, having dinner logging back in, like you just at least when I had the commute there was a bit of like a half an hour or so sitting on a train while I was like able to like process what was going on in my head. And yeah, it just got to the point where it was affecting me my health, like how I was behaving with Rosalie I was getting really snappy Have and then failing to get like, you know, Mum guilt that I was being snappy with her. And it was through no fault of her own, it was just that I was just exhausted, I was being a person that I didn't want to be.

Martina Fink 10:10

Yeah, it's funny how it affects, I mean, it's not even funny, it's just natural that it affects the closest relationships that we have. And often, we feel like we can express our frustration, and our anger and our exhaustion with those people. But really, actually, those are the people that deserve the best of us, because we love them so much, right. And so it's kind of like a paradox situation where the goal is to be the best version of you for the people you love, and not get your anger out on them or the frustration out on them. You talk a little bit about your daughter and how it affected that has it also impacted their relationships and your marriage?

Joanne Daniels 10:54

Yeah, definitely, I think I'm a lot more confident in myself now. And me and my husband, neither of us really like confrontation or conflict. So there'll be something really small that one will do to and it'll annoy the other one or whatever. And rather than actually sort of dealing with it in the moment, and it not becoming a big thing, we would just let it fester. Because neither of us wanted to upset the other one or whatever else. But I've noticed that where I'm a lot more confident in myself and sort of my opinions and even being honest about how I feel, it makes things so much easier. And I think our relationship has definitely got a lot stronger since like it like more recently. And I think it's partly because I'm on it on myself more I make time for self care, I make time to do the things I like to do. We've got quite a good balance now, like an evening to go and do his thing. And I can have a bit of time to do my thing be that listen to webinars, their pedicure, like whatever it is. So yeah, I definitely feel that with as a as a whole family unit. To be honest, I feel like we're much stronger.

Martina Fink 11:57

That's so beautiful. One of the things you mentioned is emotions. And I know that's where you really made the biggest quantum leap over the past few months of shifting completely into, like you said, the person you are the woman that you are today and just being yourself. And I feel like we talked about, you know, just be yourself. And it sounds so easy, but it's actually so challenging at times to even find out who am I when I am being myself? So can you share a little bit about how you felt emotionally a couple months ago, like six months ago, one year ago, like what was going on with your emotions, if anything?

Joanne Daniels 12:36

Yeah, so I think I had a way with dealing with my emotions at the time. And so um, and obviously, like, for context, I lost both my parents when I was well like around 2025. And I really struggled with that. And I think going through the program and just being more in tune with myself and sort of looking back at my beliefs and where they've come from, well, you kind of highlighted it to me that the way I was dealing with my emotions wasn't necessarily actually dealing with them. So if I, something would trigger me, whatever it might be, there would then be a downward spiral. Sometimes if I couldn't sort of snap myself out of it. And then it would lead to sort of like missing my mum and dad, and just feeling really, really low. And if I got to a certain point, my only way out was to like have a sleep. And I wouldn't want to spend time with my family, like even on Boxing Day was a good example when this happened. And obviously, we were still quite early into the program at that point. And I just, I think because I lost my mom around Christmas, so it was quite like it's quite a sense, you know, like sensitive time anyway. And yeah, Jordan took Rosalie out and I was like I just need to go might be by myself. And I just went as soon as I shut the door to them, just tears and tears and tears. And then I went and slept for a couple of hours. And then I felt better. And that was sort of my way to cope. But I think it was me sort of shutting down the thought pattern by sleeping and resetting my brain is kind of how I used to refer to it. But actually, that doesn't help me in the long term. It doesn't mean I'm dealing with it or sort of going through those emotions and like realizing them and letting them fly. And so I think that was the biggest thing. And it was obviously challenging, like talking to yourself, and then the other ladies on the program in terms of like what I went through. And we obviously went through a lot and quite a lot of detail. But even from that session that we had, when we were kind of talking about our, like all our past life experiences, I felt so much better for just talking and not being judged and being able to cry. And I think I even made him one of the other ladies cry as well. And I felt a bit bad about that. But I think that's fine. So yeah, I think that's how I would have reacted. It would have been sort of very much to shut down the scenario if it was too much for me to cope with. But now I've had. I've had examples more recently where I've reacted differently. My husband and I were like Listening to a, like a live event that a local pub was doing and somewhat and then they put a song on. And it was a song that just reminded me of my dad. And I just literally ran run to the bar for him to the first few nights that the song happened to start coming. I was like, nope, nope, nope, can't cope with this. And then I like just went into the bathroom. And I was like, hang on a minute, I can't, I can't run away. Because I don't want to every time I think of them, I don't want to be sad, I want to have so many happy memories, that I want to just think of all of that. So I kind of gave myself a quick talking to and I was like, You know what, what's the worst that can happen? It's okay to cry. So then I went back in like Jordan a turn the volume down, because I just don't run out the room. And yeah, I've kind of listened to the rest of the song. And it might sound like a silly little thing. But for me, that was a massive achievement to just be able to face the light to face that emotion. And even thinking about it makes me be a bit like, Oh, it's nice, because they, I wouldn't feel so emotional about it if they didn't mean so much to me. So it's actually coming from a lovely place that I'm having these emotions, they just kind of like pushing through pushing through them, accepting them, and then getting to a place where I'll hear that song. And I'm like, Oh, actually, you know what that was really nice times that I had with them. rather than sort of just focusing on the side and the loss,

Martina Fink 16:13

There's so much I want to say about this. And I also just got full body goosebumps when you were talking about the situation. And I remember you sharing that with the group as well. One of the things I also experienced in my life really, until recently to was the same thing of going to bed and sleeping in order to avoid facing the challenges. And I always told myself, you know, if I go to sleep, I will feel better afterwards, which is often the truth, like we usually do feel better, and we get some space and some rest. And you know, you wake up a little refreshed, but you're not really facing the actual problem. So what happens is you just avoid the emotions at all. And they're still there. And you just kind of wrap them up in a package, but you're carrying the package around with you until the next thing comes up right for you that song with your parents, for example. Or that reminded you of your parents. So another thing that you mentioned is that you close the door, and then you can cry, right? It's it's like, you used to have this shame for allowing yourself to cry. And I feel like that's something so many women struggle with, whether it's at the workplace, or it's in their families or with their loved ones or their partner, where we still believe that crying is something shameful, and that we shouldn't do that. And that is something where that we believe is a bad thing, or it just also reflects weakness. And that's how we grew up, you know, like Big Girls don't cry, and it's all going to be good. Don't worry, like, while this is true, all everything is gonna be good. In that moment, what we just want it was to be loved and to be held. And that's also what we crave. Now, when we want to cry is we just want to be held, and we want someone to understand that we are you know, safe and that it's all good. But in that process, it's so important to let things flow because crying is a way of processing and releasing. So like literally as you cry, you release the pain through your tears out of your body and out of your energy system. So I'm really, really proud of you for allowing yourself for catching yourself in that moment when you were in the bathroom and going back in. And another thing that I think is really important when it comes to past loved ones and specifically parents is that they don't want us to suffer, your parents don't want you to like you said they want you to be happy in situations like these are almost also signs from spirit or from their spirits in their souls that they are here with you and that they think of you. And that's so beautiful that you've been able to shift that energy around your parents and the memories you have with them that you can now focus on the good things and the experiences you had.

Joanne Daniels 19:00

Yeah, and I agree. And I think another thing as well as, as you mentioned is sort of like that feeling that you shouldn't cry in front of others or it's like a bad thing. Like that's something else I've noticed, like I'm much more aware of how important it is to be in tune with your emotions. And I've even kind of tried to drill that into Rosalie a little bit as well. So there was over Easter, we were I know for Mother's Day. We were supposed to pop in and see Jordan's mom and just drop her off at present but she's not been feeling very well. She's had like she's had a bit of a chest infection and she was crying as we left her she obviously wanted to see Rosalie and we were kind of all distance from her and everything else and she was really upset and I could tell that Rosa Lee didn't really know how to deal with the situation because grandma was crying. So when we got in the car I said to her I was like it's okay if you're sad like grandma's sad because she wants to spend time with you and and she's just not feeling very well at the moment and that's why she was crying and I either you can see when I I think I'm quite an I can just sort of, you know, when someone need to cry, like you can see, it's bad, but they're just not letting it out. And I could tell she was doing it. And I said to her, I was like, it's okay to cry. And then she had a cry as well afterwards, because she was just sad that she couldn't see her grandma. And I was I don't want her to feel that she has to hide like, emotion, because everyone has those emotions, obviously, like people express their emotions in different ways. But yeah, I think it is definitely something that not that I was ever brought up in a way that I shouldn't or couldn't express myself. But I don't want her to grow up in a way where she doesn't feel that she can be who she is, you know, and feel what she needs to feel in the moment.

Martina Fink 20:39

That's so important, because that's how we grew up thinking it's not safe to cry. And now we can pass this on to future generation. And that's how they are going to be dealing with conflict and you know, challenges and sadness, and which is really neat, this revolution of women teaching their their girls and boys, you know that it's safe to, it's safe to cry, and that it's normal to have emotions. And the more we can allow ourselves to feel these feelings, the less pressure we actually have. Because this also goes into work, you know, where you're, maybe you're struggling with something at work, and you're not really allowing yourself to feel it, you're just getting frustrated or angry and you avoid feeling those feelings. So you just go to work, even more frustrated the last The next day, and it just accumulates all of that until one day, you know, it explodes or leaves you with a burnout like situation.

Joanne Daniels 21:36

Yeah, exactly.

Martina Fink 21:37

And how would you say this whole experience of becoming yourself more and allowing yourself to feel more how has that impacted your career?

Joanne Daniels 21:48

It's really positive. Again, to be honest, I think when I first started the program, I said, as you mentioned, I've got quite like a high pressure job. And I am happy with my role and everything else. But one of the things that we talked about as well was sort of like law of attraction, and sort of doing like a vision board and sort of thinking about what you want. So I spend a bit of time actually thinking about what my values are my core values, because I've not really sat down and thought about that, and kind of came up with some sort of like, home or like, you know, personal things that are like, not objective, but goals that tie in with my values. And then also from a work perspective, too. And one of the things that came up for me, and that is important from like a more sort of like career work perspective is sort of like sort of progression, basically, you know, sort of always wanting to learn, like gain more knowledge. And the other thing that came up was sort of helping others. And within my my job, I work as a finance manager, and like an asset management company. So it's all very messy, a lot of accounts and things. So it's not really something that I can apply to helping others in my role. So then I kind of thought about what else could I do outside of that, that could align with that core value. So I said, Rosalie's at nursery just around the corner from us. She started there last year, and I actually joined the committee for the nursery. So I've been able to attend committee meetings and sort of add a bit of value from like my knowledge, like my finance side in terms of knowledge and just sort of being able to present ideas come up with fundraising ideas, those sorts of things. And it's probably not something that I would have even thought about if I hadn't been thinking, what are my values? Like, where do I want to go? So I think that's been a really big one for me, and then also, from a lot more in my role. And again, I think it kind of links back to this whole, speaking up for yourself and law of attraction and things. So I we got a new CFO, and he joined the company in November. And we he'd asked everyone to have one to ones with him so we could get to know the team. And when I had to catch up with him, he was asking me about my progression and sort of what I wanted. And I was quite honest about it. And I said, Yeah, I'd love to be sort of like a CFO one day. And I said to the senior managers, I'm like I can, I can be in my role and do a great job. But they have to help me get opportunities because they know the opportunities there that they have to think of me when they're sort of like making a plan or whatever else. So then there's a big project I worked on in over December time that I've specifically got hand picked for. I don't know how much of that was because I'd said like, please think of me in these sorts of situations. And but that was really good for my profile. And then yeah, in January, I actually got offered a temporary promotion to cover someone who's on maternity leave. And it's completely out of my comfort zone, because it's a different area of finance and what I do now, so the old me probably wouldn't leave them wanting to do it because I'd have been like, No, no, no, this is too much like I don't know what I'm doing. And you know, that whole idea of like, it's like a stereotype that lies for females, they have to know 100% of the job spec before they go for that job. I'm literally going into a role where I don't know a lot of the content, but because of my transferable skills they want Like my sort of senior management, they want me in that role they've asked me, and I'm kind of believing in all their belief in me if you see what I mean, it's kind of what's pushing me along. So that's been really good as well. And then yeah, and also, I've been asked to be part of the new diversity and inclusion committee that my company running. And again, last year, I shared a bit of an interest I attended, attended a couple of sessions that our CEO did. And yeah, next thing I know, I've been asked to be part of the committee. So when, yeah, I didn't, it's like the stars are aligning in a way, you know, just sort of, and I do think it's part of the energy I'm putting out there. It's sort of coming back. So yeah, from a career perspective, great, really. So I couldn't have asked for more like things that, like this time, six months ago, would never have thought would even be on the cards for me.

Martina Fink 25:47

Yeah, congratulations, that is so much, even in just three months, you know, achievements in your personal and business life. And that's really what happens because everything is energy, and the energy you send out, it's going to come back to you. But if the energy that you send out is just frustration and overwhelm, and stress, well, guess what you're going to get back, you know, in return, but when you actually take that time to get to know yourself better, and understand, like you said, what your values are, and I know for you, it's really important to help others and to serve. And that's why you're supported. You're supporting the nursery now, like just knowing that at the core, this is who Joe is. And now how can I become more of her in my everyday life? So it's not just a I'm the best version of me when I go on vacation, but I'm actually constantly living this version of me that I truly want to be.

Joanne Daniels 26:43

Yeah, exactly. And I think the thing is, as well, like we've spoken about before, it's not always, you don't always feel on top of the world every single day. But there are things that come along, and you do you do stop and think like, this is great. And I think align the more I do, I feel like I'm on like in like a bit of a snowball, you know, and it's just going to keep going. But now that I've started, like thinking about this and thinking about what's important to me, and what do I want to spend my time doing, what do I enjoy, it just seems like things are just coming up. And there's more and more that I can do in that space. And particularly with the like diversity and inclusion piece like it's obviously like globally, it's a massive thing. It always has been, but it's more in the forefront of people's minds. So I feel that that's something where I can actually really make a difference. So yeah, yeah, it's all been really positive for me.

Martina Fink 27:30

so beautiful. One of the things that you mentioned earlier was the aspect of the community and being part of a group with other women, how has that affected you and support you over the three months in the program?

Joanne Daniels 27:42

Well it was really nice to obviously get to know the other ladies, personally, I think it's been, it's great that you Well, one is that you have someone else you're accountable for or accountable to. So it kind of does. Make sure that you you prioritize yourself. And I think we all struggled with it at points throughout the program, like other things come up. And I think one of the reasons that we are perfectionist, one of those tendencies is that everyone else and everything else comes before yourself. So I think having that accountability buddy really helped sort of push us along to again, shift that mindset from, oh, I do really want to do this, it's really important for me, but Rosalie needs me or Alba work need me to do something or whatever else is quite easy to make excuses and put yourself on a back burner. And so I think it was really good to have it have the other ladies in the group from an accountability perspective. But also, I think, just to just to all feel vulnerable together. You know, I think because everyone's in the same boat, everyone has gone through their own life challenges. And they've been impacted in different ways. And they've got whatever that path they've been on has got them to being part of the perfectionist rehab course, it's really comforting to know, and really nice to know, like everyone's in that same position. And everyone wants to make themselves better. And everyone's gone through whatever it is they've gone through. And everyone was very open in terms of talking about those things. And it's not only like the high points and in those things, but it's also the lows. And I think feeling safe with a group of women that you don't realize I've never met any of you like in person. It's all been virtual, obviously. I just felt Yeah, I was in a safe space. And I think that made the program so much better for me and I got so much more out of it because of that.

Martina Fink 29:29

Yeah, and I truly believe that we don't talk about our struggles enough and share those painful moments with others. Because we feel shameful about certain things that happened in the past. And you know, we just hid under the covers and cried for ourselves instead of sharing them but once we start to open up to people that are going through or have gone through their own challenges, we feel like we belong because we notice we're not the only ones that have had difficult situations and challenges in our lives. So yeah, that's what like one of the biggest things I love in all my programs and retreats is just being able to connect women that are on a similar level and similar journey because I experienced that myself, like I'm best friends with some of the people that I've never met in person, and that I talked to every week now, because we're in the same program. And we have like, we understand each other so well, because we are going through similar challenges. So yeah, and the accountability piece, of course, is massive for perfectionist, because it's so easy to give up on your plans and not follow through and get overwhelmed, and then procrastinate and not do anything. So I'm really, really glad that this has supported you.

Joanne Daniels 30:45

Yeah, definitely.

Martina Fink 30:46

How would you describe your glowing life?

Joanne Daniels 30:50

I'd say I'm still a work in progress. I don't think I'm there yet. But I think I'm definitely on the right path. And for me, it's about living in the moment more. That's one of the key things, I think it's very easy to always be thinking about the next 10 things you need to do or thinking about, oh, yeah, when when I achieve this, then I'll be happier when I'll achieve that I'll be happy or let me have this house. So you know, it's all very sort of like in the future. But I think as well, like one of the things obviously I've I've learned a lot through what's happened in my life is that you're not around forever, you know, and sometimes the time that you have on yourself can be quite short. So you shouldn't always be trying to live for the future. And you need to enjoy now. So I think that's one of the big things, and for me as well is like getting that work life balance right and, and aligning with my values like now that I figured out like one of the other things that came up on the program was my connection with my family, like my wider family. And I thought that a lot of the stuff I tried to do was because I was trying to sort of like, continuing my mom's legacy, because my mom was the one that would organize events and do things. But then as we discussed it more and I thought about it, I was like Actually, no, I actually really love doing those things. I'm not doing it for her, I'm doing it because I personally get a lot out of it as well. So I think it's just obviously current situation is not that easy. But it definitely makes me sort of prioritize spending time like even on zoom or WhatsApp calls, like with my family just to catch up and check in with them. And yeah, just having a bit of balance of sort of, what are the things I like to do for me, making sure that I have time for those looking after my body, looking after my health, having that quality time with my family and just being happy. And just when you have that moment of like just laughing or whatever it is just stop and just feel it rather than just moving on to the next thing, which is something that I think I always used to do. Because I was never in the moment in the first place. I was always like, my head was somewhere else thinking about our What are we going to have for dinner later? Or what are we going to do tomorrow or whatever it is, they I think it's just having that having that balance, enjoying life basically, and aligning more with my values as well.

Martina Fink 33:00

Beautiful reminder to really just remain present, which is definitely a very common struggle among perfectionist we're either worrying about the future or regretting things in the past that we do did or didn't do. And we can all use a bit more, you know, presence in our lives for sure. Now, you talked a lot about like doing things for you, what are some of the non negotiable self care things that you do now?

Joanne Daniels 33:26

So one of the big things for me at the moment is my exercise. So I will get up early in the morning and do some sort of exercise. And I feel I feel so much better on the days when I do something than the days that I don't. And I also feel like it's my time. So I get up before Rosalie and Jordan are awake. So it doesn't sort of impact on any time with them. And it is time for me to be in my zone and do what I want to do. That's like the key non negotiable. And I think the other thing is my skincare routine, I probably could be better with it. But I do like to do my sort of like cleanse time moisturize like morning and night. And I will try and do face masks. And again, I don't think I've got my routine 100% as I want it yet, but again, I know I feel I feel so much better in myself if I do make the time and do my nails as well. I do try to do those too.

Martina Fink 34:20

So beautiful. Yeah, and we can always do better. Like let's be honest in everything, we could always do better, but it's all about starting the process and can and sticking to it consistently that is going to make the difference and certain things that I'm doing now for myself or have become so natural, like brushing brushing my teeth in the morning and I don't even think about it anymore, you know and you will get to that point where your skincare just becomes normal and you doing face masks regularly just becomes normal. You don't even think about it as like, oh I should do something because it's just who you are. So you're on a on an amazing path to taking better care of yourself and just be present with it and enjoy what you're doing now. And then take the next step whenever you feel like okay, now I can add one more thing because what we sometimes think is like, we have to do all the things right like Manny, Petey have the perfect terror workout, meditate all these things together and and then you want to start it and you you stop after two days because it's this whole mountain of things that you want to do. Instead, just start with one thing and then take it one step at a time, like baby steps. Now before we wrap up, I have a couple of quick questions for you.

Joanne Daniels 35:37

Okay.

Martina Fink 35:38

If you if there was one thing that you could take with you to go on a desert island, what would it be?

Joanne Daniels 35:46

Assuming I have all the necessities I need? It probably just be like a good book. I think something that I can just sort of like, drift away to.

Martina Fink 35:54

Love it, in a hammock?

Joanne Daniels 35:56

Yeah, that'd be good. I was like my sunglasses. I would need those as well. But I was like, should I say Rosalie? And then I will probably be more relaxing if she wasn't there.

Martina Fink 36:07

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I in an ideal world, you'll be able to take a lot more with you. Do you do smoothies to drink?

Joanne Daniels 36:17

Yes.

Martina Fink 36:17

What is your favorite smoothie at the moment?

Joanne Daniels 36:21

So I have a style spinach, mango and ginger. And movie, and I have it with coconut water in the morning?

Martina Fink 36:32

Yeah, very tropical and nice.

Joanne Daniels 36:34

Yeah, it's a fight like, obviously green. So when I first tried it out a bit, I'm not sure about this one. But yeah, it's really nice and really feeling as well, I think when I first switched out, because before I was having like, a milk based one. And I think it was just too heavy for me in the mornings. And but yeah, when I switched over, like the first few days, I was like, I feel a bit hungry. But then after that your body just gets used to it. And I think on the days I don't have it like at weekends, I might not have it. But I can tell the difference in my energy levels and just how now I start the day.

Martina Fink 37:04

Mmmm, powerful, love that. I will have to try the mango, mango with greens wines. So good. What are three things that you are grateful for today, Joe?

Joanne Daniels 37:15

The fact that the sun is shining today, the fact I'm not working today. And and being able to do this, you know, like, I think just my mindset? Yeah, it's a massive change I could have all morning I could have been procrastinating about this and stressing, but I've just been fine. And yeah, honestly, I've never thought that I could get to a place like this, I could feel so different.

Martina Fink 37:38

You know, it's so funny. I was emailing with someone earlier this week around perfectionism and the stress and overwhelm that she was experiencing. And, and I asked her like, are you? Are you interested in actually resolving this? And you know, getting out on the other side? And she responded, saying like, Yes, I am totally interested, if that's even possible. And I'm like, of course it's possible. Of course, it's possible. And like you're one of the best examples of this. Do you have some final advice if anybody is considering, you know, joining Perfectionist Rehab, or just taking a first step towards releasing that perfectionist side of them and, and really shift out into a slower, more confident, glowing life, how I call it? What would you say to them?

Joanne Daniels 38:29

I think if you're considering it, definitely go for it. I think like maybe the person you were talking about earlier that I was the same. I think the reason why attitude was that I don't even know if I can get myself out of this is because I tried so many things on my own. And again, it comes down to being a perfectionist like you know that you don't want to be the way you are for whatever reason. You try this, you try that you try something else, and you don't get the results. And I think it can be quite disheartening. But I'd say go there. 100% Go for it. And like I say, I've I've tried other things that haven't worked out for me. And this is a change that is gradual. It doesn't happen sort of overnight, but it's incremental. And yeah, definitely the best thing that I've done, I prioritize myself, which isn't something that I do often. And it's paid off for me and for my family like I'm a better person generally. And I'm more myself because I've attended the course. So anyone who is sort of like on the shelf about it, believe in yourself believe in what like Martina can provide like believing the change you can make for yourself.

Martina Fink 39:33

Yeah, like believe in the possibility there that there is another life available to you. And I love that you mentioned the incremental change. I remember a situation where that you shared where you were going for a walk and you certainly felt different about it.

Joanne Daniels 39:50

Yeah, yeah. So we do pretty much the same dog walk most weekends. And yeah, I don't know. I just we went did exactly the same thing. The sun was out. So maybe that helped a little bit. But I just, it just felt different. I just felt different, even though it's exactly the same. And I even said, Jordan was like, do you feel like there's different today? And he was like, No, I don't know what you mean. And so obviously, it's something in me like the way that I'm taking in the surroundings, or just the way that I am. I'm just Yeah, like gradually changing for the better, more appreciative of life of like, what's going on around me being with my family being more present, basically,

Martina Fink 40:29

yeah. Which is interesting, because we always think in order to change, we need to have these big massive changes and quit the job and find something new and leave the relationship or have a relationship, whatever it is, but really, those changes are so tiny and so small, but so meaningful, because it affects the relationships and your health and everything directly. So I love that you share this experience with us. Thank you so much, Jo, for spending this time with me and for sharing your experience. I know so many women are going through the exact same thing that you went through earlier, you know, last year and stuff. And so I think it's just very inspiring to see what's truly possible without quitting your job and without, you know, turning your life upside down. But really just making those small, incremental changes in your own life and your own habits to to do that for you so that you can have a calm and peaceful mind and not feel overwhelmed all of the time.

Joanne Daniels 41:28

Yeah, I think just one more thing I'd like to add, if that's okay, that, I think sometimes, and I was a bit overwhelmed when I first signed up to the course, because I was like, how much work is it going to be? How much time is it going to take for these things they don't pay time. So obviously, we have our homework that we need to do. But we'll have conversation as part of one of our sessions. And they'll be something that I just take away from that. And it's in my subconscious, I'm not even consciously being like, I need to remember this thing. And then something will come up. And I'm like, and the dots just connect. So for anyone out there who's interested, like, please don't feel that you're adding another, like massive task onto your plate where you already feel overwhelmed. Like, that's not how it works. It's just, it's just simple little things. Sometimes a new brain starts connecting those dots and new, you think things slightly differently. And yeah, that's where it all starts. And but even those small things can make a big impact. And that you say, it's like the ripple effect, isn't it like a little change, but then it can have a massive impact in terms of like how the rest of your day goes, like just your approach on things. And yeah, don't feel overwhelmed by partaking in the course. Because it's not you don't have to spend loads of time, constantly thinking about it to be able to make the changes, they do just happen. And over time.

Martina Fink 42:44

Yeah. And it's also lasting change that you're creating, really with this. So like, imagine how much you'd be willing to pay to get rid of all the stress forever, you know? Like, how much is that actually worth? Is it worth three months of investing in yourself and taking some time here and there to actually sit down and do some homework like 100% 100% worth it? Thank you so much. It's been so great to speak with you. I really appreciate your time and your willingness to open up and just I also love seeing you glow and you sharing everything with your the people in your life to

Joanne Daniels 43:21

Yeah, thank you very much for having me. And yeah, again, being able to help others. So even if one person listens to this and sort of gets a little bit of input inspiration from it. That's why I wanted to do it. Even though I don't like doing this sort of thing. It's out of my comfort zone. I was like No, do you know what for the greater good and for what I want to try and achieve? Like, let me see if I can help someone. So yeah, thank you very much for having me.

Martina Fink 43:42

I cannot put into words how grateful I am for the kind of women that come to me for support with perfectionism. And being able to be on this journey with Joe and support her in this process has meant so much for me and just to see how her glow has come to live and how she's been able to ripple that out to her immediate family and her work. And her career in so many different ways is just so beautiful to see if any of the things that Joe mentioned today resonate with you and you're like, this is exactly what I'm going through. And this is exactly what I'm struggling with overwhelm control stress, low self worth, not feeling confident, a lot of negative self talk and perfectionism that stopping you please take a courageous step forward and do something about it. I have a free self care guide for perfectionists that you can download or you can join us directly in perfectionist rehab, which is a 90 day healing journey out of overwhelm into a fulfilled and glowing life where you take care of yourself first without feeling guilty and without compromising results. You can find more about perfectionist rehab on Martina fink.com forward slash rehab it wouldn't mean so much to me if you left us a review on iTunes if you enjoyed this episode and if it has been helpful for you to live a more glowing life follow the glow life podcast on iTunes and Spotify and for everything we mentioned in today's episode, you can go check out the show notes at Martina Fink comm slash podcasts slash 134. If anyone in your life is going through similar challenges that Joe has gone through in her life in the past year alone, please forward this episode to them right now. Thank you so much for being here today and for caring for yourself so deeply because what you do for yourself is going to impact every single soul that you touch would love to connect with you on social media. You can find me at Martina glows on Instagram and Facebook and I just want you to know that you deserve to feel glowing and confident, beautiful.

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